Legislature(2001 - 2002)

04/09/2002 01:34 PM Senate TRA

Audio Topic
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
          SB 100-PERSONAL MOTOR VEHICLES/ REGISTRATION                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
MS. KELLY  HUBER, staff  to Senator  Halford,  sponsor of SB  100,                                                              
informed  members  that a  proposed  committee substitute  was  in                                                              
members'  packets.  She  noted  the  sponsor  has  requested  that                                                              
members  adopt  the proposed  committee  substitute  and that  she                                                              
would address that version (Version  L). She described the bill as                                                              
follows.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
This bill was introduced because  of new technology. A new device,                                                              
called the electric  personal motor vehicle assistive  device, was                                                              
unveiled in the fall of 2001. It  is a clean fuel, quiet, upright,                                                              
two-wheel  tandem device  that  can  travel at  15  mph, that  was                                                              
designed for use  in pedestrian areas. Senator  Halford introduced                                                              
this legislation  to make sure that  use of those vehicles  is not                                                              
prohibited in certain areas and so  that registration licensure is                                                              
not required. The proposed committee  substitute addresses changes                                                              
in  statute  concerning  farm  and   construction  vehicles.  That                                                              
provision was removed  from Version L. Another  provision that was                                                              
removed  from  Version  L  prohibited   departments  from  writing                                                              
regulations   concerning  the  assistive   mobility  device.   The                                                              
departments  will be  able to  write regulations  but they  cannot                                                              
prohibit  use   of  the   device.  She   said  she  believes   the                                                              
Administration supports the legislation.                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
CHAIRMAN  COWDERY  asked  if  the   legislation  also  applies  to                                                              
electric wheelchairs.                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
MS.  HUBER  said she  does  not  believe  there are  any  problems                                                              
associated  with  electric  wheelchairs  right  now.  The  sponsor                                                              
statement  refers to  wheelchairs as  an example  of an  assistive                                                              
mobility device  that is useful to  senior citizens. She  said the                                                              
sponsor wants  the electric personal  motor vehicle to  be treated                                                              
similar to  an electric wheelchair  rather than any other  type of                                                              
transportation.                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
CHAIRMAN COWDERY asked  if the electric personal  motor vehicle is                                                              
a two-wheeled vehicle.                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
MS. HUBER said it is and that the rider stands on it.                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
CHAIRMAN COWDERY noted the presence of Senator Taylor.                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
There  being no  further questions,  SENATOR WARD  moved to  adopt                                                              
Version L of SSSB 100 as the working document of the committee.                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
CHAIRMAN COWDERY  announced that without objection,  Version L was                                                              
adopted.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  ELTON asked  Ms. Huber if  enactment  of this bill  would                                                              
preclude  any  municipality  from  regulating  the  use  of  these                                                              
devices on city sidewalks.                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
MS. HUBER  said the  bill does not  contain a municipal  exemption                                                              
area, based  on the  idea that  this technology  is new  and there                                                              
will not  be many  of these devices  on the  streets for  a while.                                                              
Should an  issue arise later  on, the  matter can be  addressed at                                                              
that time.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR ELTON  said he hates to  sound like the  only conservative                                                              
in the room,  but it seems to  him that the legislature  would not                                                              
want  government  to mandate  rules  until  a problem  arises.  He                                                              
stated, "That  almost seems  backward to me  - that you're  saying                                                              
well, there may  or may not be a problem but we're  going to allow                                                              
it anyway." He said his concern is  that negotiating the sidewalks                                                              
in downtown  Juneau during  the cruise  ship season is  difficult.                                                              
Juneau  has  banned  the  use of  skateboards  on  sidewalks.  The                                                              
electric personal  motor vehicles travel five times  faster than a                                                              
normal person  walks and probably  10 times faster than  a tourist                                                              
ambles  through the  community. He  repeated that  he is having  a                                                              
difficult time with the concept that  state government is going to                                                              
tell  communities  how to  regulate  traffic in  highly  congested                                                              
areas.                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
MS. HUBER  responded that  it is not  that the sponsor  disagrees,                                                              
but he  does not foresee  any problems  at this time.  She pointed                                                              
out that electric wheelchairs travel on sidewalks.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR   ELTON  said   if,   in  fact,   there   is  a   problem,                                                              
municipalities  will have to  come to  the legislature  to request                                                              
that  the statute  be  amended  so that  they  can  deal with  the                                                              
problem.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
CHAIRMAN  COWDERY  asked  if  the   state  has  jurisdiction  over                                                              
municipal rights-of-way.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR TAYLOR said  it does. He asked if electric  personal motor                                                              
vehicles could travel on bike paths  and whether the sponsor would                                                              
object to a friendly  amendment allowing snow machines  to use the                                                              
bike paths also.                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
MS. HUBER said they would be allowed to travel on bike paths.                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
CHAIRMAN COWDERY took public testimony.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
MR.  DENNIS HARRIS  informed members  that  he is  very active  in                                                              
Juneau's  cycling  community.  He  is very  concerned  about  this                                                              
legislation for several reasons,  one being that there are already                                                              
many  conflicts on  multiple-use  paths. Those  paths are  already                                                              
congested, particularly  sidewalks in downtown Juneau.  He pointed                                                              
out there  is a  good reason  why state  law and  most city  codes                                                              
don't allow  the use of  bicycles on  sidewalks by anyone  over 12                                                              
years old  - because bicycles  move at  a much greater  speed than                                                              
pedestrians; the same reason skateboards  are prohibited in a good                                                              
part of  the downtown area  of Juneau.   Many elderly  people with                                                              
osteoporosis  fear bicycles and  skateboards on sidewalks  because                                                              
if  they fall,  their  injuries  are slow  to  heal.  He said  his                                                              
biggest concern about  this bill is that the first  orders will be                                                              
delivered to businesses  such as UPS and FedEx  for commercial use                                                              
in the next six  months. The manufacturer does not  expect them to                                                              
be in general use  for at least two years and  the manufacturer is                                                              
engaged in  a giant lobbying effort  across the country  to exempt                                                              
these vehicles from regulation. He stated:                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
     That's  what  this  bill  does  and  it's  wrong.  Quite                                                                   
     frankly,  we should  allow  some experience  with  these                                                                   
     vehicles before we decide what  kind of regulation to do                                                                   
     but  in  my opinion  they  should  not  be -  this  bill                                                                   
     essentially prohibits cities  from prohibiting their use                                                                   
     on  a sidewalk.  I can  just see  the situation  between                                                                   
     here and the  Governor's Mansion on Calhoun  Avenue - on                                                                   
     that very narrow  sidewalk - where someone  is trying to                                                                   
     zip along and get to work on  their segue at 15 miles an                                                                   
     hour and  it's crowded with  pedestrians in  the morning                                                                   
     trying to walk to work and there's  heavy traffic in the                                                                   
     street. This  is just not a  good idea. I think  we need                                                                   
     to  wait and see  what kind  of experience  we can  have                                                                   
     with these vehicles.                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
MR. HARRIS said his other concern  is that people are not aware of                                                              
the mass  of these vehicles. They  weigh 80 pounds and  can travel                                                              
at  20 mph.  The delivery  devices  will be  set at  12.5 mph.  He                                                              
expressed concern  that the  promotion of  these devices  has been                                                              
disingenuous because  they are referred  to as personal  assistive                                                              
mobility  devices, which  sounds  like something  for  use by  the                                                              
handicapped.  However, they  will  not work  for many  handicapped                                                              
people  because  passengers  must  stand  to ride  them.  He  also                                                              
expressed  concern that  this bill  will take  away local  control                                                              
over  these devices.  He  indicated that  most  bicycle paths  and                                                              
pedestrian walkways alongside federal  aid highways in Alaska were                                                              
financed  by a federal  law.   Under that  federal law,  this bill                                                              
would not  be legal because the  federal law prohibits the  use of                                                              
any kind of motorized device on a  sidewalk or pedestrian way that                                                              
was  built with  federal aid  dollars.  He offered  to submit  the                                                              
correct citation to members.                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIRMAN  COWDERY asked  Mr.  Harris to  describe  a multiple  use                                                              
path.                                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
MR. HARRIS  said that  multiple use paths  were designed  for non-                                                              
motorized use,  which is what is  stated in federal law.  He added                                                              
that in  doing research for a  proposed Juneau ordinance  to allow                                                              
the use  of motorized skooters, he  found they were  prohibited by                                                              
the same  federal law.  He urged  members to  move slowly  on this                                                              
legislation  as it  needs further  research,  particularly in  the                                                              
pedestrian conflict area.                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  TAYLOR  pointed  out  that,   according  to  the  sponsor                                                              
statement,  "the National  Highway  Traffic Safety  Administration                                                              
ruled this device  is not a motor vehicle and should  not be under                                                              
their  jurisdiction." He  also  pointed out  that  12 states  have                                                              
enacted similar legislation.                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR. HARRIS  said as far as he  is aware, the only activity  at the                                                              
federal level regarding  use of these devices is  a bill sponsored                                                              
by  Senator Bob  Smith  of New  Hampshire.  He said  use of  these                                                              
devices is  still prohibited by the  U.S. Code unless it  has been                                                              
changed in  the last six  months and  that maybe those  states are                                                              
ignoring the  federal law. He  repeated the manufacturer  has made                                                              
an aggressive lobbying effort in  every state. He said he believes                                                              
they  could  be  a great  idea  for  commercial  use  for  package                                                              
delivery as long as the vehicles are not running on sidewalks.                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
MR.  DENNIS  POSHARD,  Special  Assistant  at  the  Department  of                                                              
Transportation  and Public Facilities  (DOTPF), told  members that                                                              
DOTPF has  taken no position on  this bill. He clarified  that the                                                              
National Highway  Traffic Safety Administration has  made a ruling                                                              
that  classifies   this  particular  device  as   a  non-motorized                                                              
vehicle. He  pointed out  that Section 1  of this bill  applies to                                                              
the state and  says that regulations adopted may  not prohibit the                                                              
use of  an electric personal  motor vehicle; however,  DOTPF could                                                              
adopt  regulations  that limit  their  use.  He assumed  the  same                                                              
provisions  under the Alaska  Uniform Traffic  Act would  apply to                                                              
local  governments so  they  could regulate  the  use of  electric                                                              
personal vehicles but not prohibit their use.                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR ELTON asked if he is correct  in assuming that the city of                                                              
Juneau could  not prohibit the  use of electric  personal vehicles                                                              
on sidewalks in the core downtown  area during the tourist season.                                                              
                                                                                                                                
MR. POSHARD  said he is  not qualified  to make a legal  analysis,                                                              
but his initial  reaction is that  a local government may  be able                                                              
to further  restrict  them. He is  aware of  certain traffic  laws                                                              
that local  governments have  adopted, particularly  in Anchorage,                                                              
that  are more  restrictive than  those contained  in the  state's                                                              
Uniform Traffic Act.  He did not know whether any  local laws have                                                              
been challenged.  He said the  Department of Law  recently pointed                                                              
out that Sec.  28.01.010 of the Alaska Uniform  Traffic Act reads,                                                              
"The provisions  of this title  and the regulations  adopted under                                                              
this  title  are  applicable within  all  municipalities  of  this                                                              
state."  He indicated  that could  be  legally interpreted  either                                                              
way.                                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
CHAIRMAN  COWDERY asked  Mr. Poshard  if he was  referring  to the                                                              
restriction  on  truck  routes  in   Anchorage  and  whether  that                                                              
restriction  was made  because  certain roads  were  not built  to                                                              
withstand heavy truck traffic.                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
MR. POSHARD  said he believes  that is  true but noted  that other                                                              
provisions adopted  by the local government in  Anchorage are more                                                              
restrictive than the Uniform Traffic Act.                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR TAYLOR said one could shoot  a cannon down the main street                                                              
of Wrangell  in the summer  and not hurt  anyone. He  suggested if                                                              
pedestrian traffic is a problem in  Juneau in the summertime, that                                                              
some of the pedestrians be sent to other communities.                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
CHAIRMAN COWDERY continued to take public testimony.                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
MS. MARY  MARSHBURN, Director  of the  Division of Motor  Vehicles                                                              
(DMV)  in  the Department  of  Administration,  said  she  assumes                                                              
members  are aware  of a  glitch in  current law  that requires  a                                                              
driver's  license to  operate a  snow  machine and  HB 397,  which                                                              
seeks to  fix that  glitch for  snow machines  and other  vehicles                                                              
that are not  designed for road use. She noted  that under current                                                              
law,  electronic  personal  vehicles  would be  defined  as  motor                                                              
vehicles and  because they do  not meet federal  safety standards,                                                              
they could  not be used  on the roadway.  Passage of HB  397 would                                                              
resolve that problem.                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
CHAIRMAN  COWDERY asked  if any  licensing  requirements apply  to                                                              
bicycles.                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
MS. MARSHBURN said none do.                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  WARD  asked Ms.  Marshburn  if  it  is her  opinion  that                                                              
drivers' licenses would be required  to drive an electric personal                                                              
motor vehicle.                                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
MS.  MARSHBURN  replied,  "Mr. Chairman,  very,  very  technically                                                              
because of a glitch in the law, yes."                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR WARD  said her  interpretation is  different than  his. He                                                              
asked her  to forward her opinion  to the committee in  writing so                                                              
that he could take a closer look at the issue.                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
CHAIRMAN  COWDERY asked  Ms. Marshburn  if she  would consider  an                                                              
electric personal motor vehicle to be a motor vehicle.                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
MS. MARSHBURN  said they  are motor  vehicles by state  definition                                                              
because they are self-propelled devices.  Because they do not meet                                                              
the federal  safety equipment standards  required under  13AAC 04,                                                              
they cannot be operated on a roadway.                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  WARD asked  Ms.  Marshburn  if she  has  read the  latest                                                              
committee substitute (Version L)  and whether it is her impression                                                              
that this version  will allow electric personal  motor vehicles to                                                              
be operated on roadways.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
MS. MARSHBURN said she has the original bill.                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR WARD  said a previous  witness mentioned  skateboards with                                                              
motors and asked if DMV requires skateboards to be licensed.                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MS. MARSHBURN said DMV does not.                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR WARD asked why not.                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
MS.  MARSHBURN  said a  motorized  skateboard  does not  meet  the                                                              
definition of a motor vehicle.                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  WARD asked  if an  electric personal  motor vehicle  does                                                              
even though the federal government has ruled otherwise.                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
MS. MARSHBURN said  that is correct. It is her  understanding that                                                              
the National  Highway Traffic Safety Administration  makes rulings                                                              
based on  the role that agency  will play in developing  standards                                                              
for vehicles.  The rulings have nothing  to do with  the operation                                                              
of the vehicles.                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR WARD asked why a skateboard  with a small gas engine and a                                                              
steering  device  would  not  be considered  to  be  a  licensable                                                              
vehicle while an electric personal motor vehicle would be.                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
MS. MARSHBURN  said she did not  know that she could  give Senator                                                              
Ward an  answer to the  technicalities. She  stated, "And  I would                                                              
emphasize   -   you   know,  emphasize,   that   in   the   strict                                                              
interpretation of  the definition of  motor vehicle is  what we're                                                              
talking  about for  the segue  or the  IT just  as it  was a  very                                                              
strict interpretation  of the driver license law,  which said it's                                                              
required for a snow machine. That  certainly was not the intent of                                                              
the law."  She pointed  out this  refers to  a vehicle license  as                                                              
opposed to a driver license.                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIRMAN  COWDERY  said  he believes  Senator  Ward  is  concerned                                                              
because Mr.  Poshard just said  that an electronic  personal motor                                                              
vehicle is not considered to be a  motor vehicle under the federal                                                              
guidelines. He  asked Ms.  Marshburn if she  has actually  seen an                                                              
electronic personal motor vehicle.                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
MS. MARSHBURN said she has seen pictures of them.                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR WARD asked Ms. Marshburn  to send a written explanation to                                                              
members of how she arrived at her  opinion that a driver's license                                                              
would be required to operate an electric personal motor vehicle.                                                                
                                                                                                                                
MS. MARSHBURN agreed to do so.                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
There  being  no  further testimony,  SENATOR  WARD  moved  CSSSSB
100(TRA) from committee with individual recommendations.                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR ELTON  objected for the  purpose of addressing  a proposed                                                              
amendment.  He  proposed  that  on  page  1,  line  12,  following                                                              
"personal  motor  vehicle  on  a,"  the  words  "state  owned  and                                                              
maintained"  be inserted.  He explained  with  that amendment  the                                                              
state  could  mandate that  electric  personal  motorized  devices                                                              
could be used  on state sidewalks, vehicular ways  and bike paths,                                                              
but it would  preserve the point of view that  the best government                                                              
is  the  government   closest  to  the  people   and  allow  local                                                              
governments to implement their own rules.                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR WARD objected.                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR TAYLOR said  he was taken with Mr. Harris's  testimony, as                                                              
he believes these vehicles will be  difficult to navigate. He said                                                              
he does not  know that Senator Elton's amendment  accomplishes his                                                              
goal  because  he   does  not  know  that  the   state  does  much                                                              
maintenance on any of those paths.                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
MS. HUBER  said she  understands Senator  Elton's intent,  but she                                                              
believes  his amendment  would  be  difficult to  enforce  because                                                              
state  roads are  within  cities and  could  cause confusion.  She                                                              
asked the Chairman  if he would be willing to hold  the bill until                                                              
Thursday so  that she could work  with members on a  local option.                                                              
She  said she  would  also look  at what  other  states that  have                                                              
passed similar legislation have done.                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR ELTON said that would be great.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
CHAIRMAN  COWDERY  said  the  committee  has a  full  calendar  on                                                              
Thursday so he will reschedule it on Thursday or Tuesday.                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR WARD  reminded the  Chairman that his  motion to  move the                                                              
bill from  committee was  still active. He  said he does  not want                                                              
the Anchorage coastal trail exempted from this bill.                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR ELTON stated,  "Mr. Chair, what I would suggest  is that I                                                              
don't have  a problem with  that - I  think it's very  generous of                                                              
the sponsor's office  to make the offer and if, in  fact, we can't                                                              
come to some kind of an agreement,  I might vote against moving it                                                              
but I  certainly wouldn't try  to get in the  way of moving  it. I                                                              
would  think  that moving  the  bill,  either  amended or  in  its                                                              
present form, will take a matter  of less than a minute." He noted                                                              
he maintained his objection.                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  WARD repeated  his motion  to move  CSSSSB 100(TRA)  from                                                              
committee with individual recommendations.                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR ELTON objected  and said this bill imposes  big government                                                              
rules that  the municipalities  will have to  live under.  He said                                                              
electric personal  motor vehicles  would create  a big  problem in                                                              
his community.                                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  WARD   stated  this  legislation  says   that  electronic                                                              
personal  motor vehicles  cannot be  prohibited; it  does not  say                                                              
they cannot be regulated.                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
CHAIRMAN COWDERY announced the motion  carried with Senators Ward,                                                              
Taylor and Cowdery in favor and Senator Elton opposed.                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  TAYLOR noted  for  the record  that  he  would work  with                                                              
Senator Elton and the sponsor's staff to try to create a local                                                                  
option.                                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR WARD said he would do likewise.                                                                                         

Document Name Date/Time Subjects